Face of Guernsey could be changed dramatically

PLANNERS have given the green light to three major developments that would change the face of Guernsey.

Plans for an extension of Admiral Park include a 300-seat cinema which would have to be operating for the developers to proceed beyond a third of the planned office space.
Plans for an extension of Admiral Park include a 300-seat cinema which would have to be operating for the developers to proceed beyond a third of the planned office space.

PLANNERS have given the green light to three major developments that would change the face of Guernsey.

They have recommended that outline planning permission be given for the next stage of the Admiral Park development, which includes extensive office space, a hotel and, potentially, a cinema, despite concerns the  complex will cause significant traffic problems.

Full planning permission should be given for redeveloping the former Guernsey Brewery site at the Havelet to provide 33 new homes, they say.

And they have backed the demolition of the former Hotel Les Carterets at Cobo so that a block of 12 three-storey apartments can be built there instead.

Comments for: "Face of Guernsey could be changed dramatically"

slinky

Great news for the local economy!

Ray

slinky

That depends on how many workers are imported to do the work I suppose

I hope while they are at it at Admiral Park they shave a couple of feet off the ridiculously wide pavements to help ease the traffic flow heading East

Other posters are asking about building affordable flats.It would be interesting to have an idea of what first time buyers would class as affordable these days

Radical

Progress at last! Let's make sure the developers have to honour their word and have to use the land as intended, i.e. build a cinema. Something the Island really lacks (I don't count the Mallard as a cinema....)

I hope the accomodation they are building is not more of the same overpriced 'luxury' apartments for open market and wealthy licence holders. There should be stipulations as to the price these units can be sold for to ensure the young people of Guernsey will actually benefit from developments such as this. It seems to me that the Island is saturated with high end apartments that our young have to pay very high rents for. It would be good to get radical and create a young persons development, i.e. under 30 / firtst time buyers only allowed and fit the accomodation around their needs and budgets if possible.

snowman

I agree wholeheartedly with the post! But its not only the under thirties that cant afford the house prices - I am over thirty and on a decent salary and I was told recently by a bank to purchase a 2-3 bedroom hous/flat I would need a minimum of £56,000 for a depoist (5% fees and 5% deposit for a mortgage of just over £300,000 and both my wife and I would need to be on a combined income of £59,000! ridiculous! I work 6 days a week and long hours so my wife cannot get a full time job as we have young children and if she goes out to work she would lose 60-70% of the wage on Child care. The only thing she can do is work from home - which is ok when the little ones are in bed!

Gaz

Aren't there enough empty offices over here already?

snowman

yeah your're right - half are the ones at adimral park waiting to be demolished and the other half have been built - but the rent is so high people cant afford to move in !!!

Vincent

With regards to the brewery and hotel le carteret, Hopefully it will mean there are some AFFORDABLE flats/houses for first time buyers, without rich parents its impossible to buy anything at the moment!

Victor Meldrew

I don't believe it, more office space who the hell for, take a look around at all the empty office space now, I mean who passes all this? Yet makes such a fuss about trivial things like a temporary A board, fence panel, gate post etc. Beggars belief.

j

If they are building seafront apartments there is no way that they will be affordable.

And even if they do sell a couple at low prices i'm sure they will be snapped up by investors before they are officially available and rented or sold for huge profits within days

Mona

A new cinema sounds great, but then you read the rest... 3 screens 300 seats - 10 rows of 10 in each - isn't the Mallard bigger than that ?

Grala

I think you might be right, but I suppose if the screens were bigger than the Mallard, people would still prefer it.

John

Are you sure it's not 300 seats in each?

Ed

I earnestly hope that this idea gets rejected. Don't those participating in this venture believe that such time and capital could be used in a far profitable manner ? I do not care whether people are disgruntled about not having a large enough cinema, we can no longer allow such precious funds to be squandered on something that will become a banal part of our existence after the fervour has evaporated...

Choose life- invest in agriculture and climate change mitigaiton strategies.

markB

ED..Is it not private money being used to develope this??....Plus it will look a site better than the old Gas Building that's there.

Ray

Ed

It might be worth your while seeing if you can bunk an hour or so off school to attend the public hearing on the proposed plans

They take 'pre-notice' questions from the floor so all you need to do is inform Environment that you intend to ask why these multi million pound sites cannot be utilised for growing turnips

You'll probably advance your education more in that hour than you will for the rest of the term

Ed

Further to this argument is my indignation towards the fact that people are discontented with what the island already has. These people just need to accept that they can't access everything that they desire, but must create artificial enjoyment for themselves. If people indulged in pursuits such as reading non-fiction and investing time into education and work then there would be no need for anybody to consider embarking upon a fresh enterprise...

markB

"reading non-fiction and investing time into education and work "

So what about leisure time Ed?... like going to the Cinema to watch a Ggood Syfi movie!

Hartley

I'll lay dollars to dinars that the Cinema never happens or is actually some form of corporate-only presentation facility.

Dave

The island is overpopulated already, so more office buildings will bring in more people leading to more houses needed, more traffic jams, more roadworks.

In order to protect the island for our grandchildren, there needs to be a block on new office development and no more building on land which could be used for growing crops in the future

Spartacus

Dave

Guernsey has 60K on 24 square miles. Manhattan has 70K per square mile. There is room for expansion. The penchant for detached bungalows may need a rethink though.

Beanjar

Spartacus, that's a rather silly example. What have we got in common with Manhattan or the slums of Rio de Janeiro? Guernsey IS highly populated for a rural island. Rather than just downtown Manhattan why not compare us with the whole of the USA - population 84 psm! Or more realistically with the UK which is regarded as fairly densely populated at a mere 650psm - Guernsey is nearly four times that.

Ray

Beanjar

I think ( I hope) Spartacus is referring to the rather wasteful use of very limited building land in the island

For example Cour du Parc with 40 / 42 flats sits on a plot which would barely take two new bungalows

Building plots are being advertised for 300K plus.It might upset some traditionalists but someone is going to have to grasp the build upwards nettle sooner or later

Spartacus

Beanjar

Ray is spot on about my comment. Guernsey population will need to expand, best it is well planned.

Guern abroad

Guerney's population does not need to expand.

The sooner that nettle is grasped the better.

GM

Guern abroad

I suggest you read the demographic projections. By 2030 there will be barely enough people of working age to fund the old age pensions of the current "baby boomers".

We need sensibly controlled and targeted immigration to get around this problem. There is no alternative unless there is an epidemic in the meantime which wipes out the elderly.

guern abroad

Exactly why the nettle has to be grasped.

You can not have an ever increasing need to increase populations. the spiral will never stop with that approach.

If we live longer we have to work longer and at the same time have realistically sized families, i.e. not more kids then there is a future for.

If we stick our heads in the sand now we will only be making it worse and yet more painful for the next generation.

rosie

Guern' abroard. I would like to think you and Dave above are right- Guernsey is becoming increasingly urbanised and less sustainable and therefore increasingly vulnerable to outside influences. However I fear that Spartacus and GM's predictions are sadly the most likely outcome. In which case, as I said in my post below (19) the nettle that needs to be urgently grasped is traffic. It is the elephant in the room that no-one wants to address but the sooner that we do, the better and easier it will be.

Guern abroad

If traffic is the elephant then population is the herd.

Population levels impact across many levels of which traffic is one.

Yes we do need to see a change of attitude to how traffic trends are managed but I would rather the effort was put into looking at ways to manage population without stepping on the increase it copout which only eliviates for one generation but experdentially increases for the next generation in a continued spiral.

Spartacus

Rosie

I agree that's why I mentioned about planning ahead. Increased population could ironically result in better public transport due to economies of scale making it more viable and efficient and by boosting states income for public services.

The main traffic problem we have, as many have identified, is that the places people need to go are spread around the island making the flexibility of car transport a necessity. There must be ways of mitigating this problem through government policies such as regulating use of property in rural and residential areas, vehicle policies etc.

The traffic problems in St Peter Port disappear during school holidays. Too many college pupils get picked up by 4x4s and this could be discouraged.

We need to protect our green spaces, particularly any greenhouse land which has been contaminated. Perhaps many of these areas should be bought by the states so they can be custodians and used as community spaces or let out commercially under strict conditions until they can be returned to agricultural use. It would be a long term investment.

kat

They should update the very big cinema at Beau se jour , this will bring money to it

and how can you have sea view flat with a dirty great big office / bank in front?

Give the land to the GHA to build cheaper accommodation for LOCALS

Guern abroad

Totally agree, but fat chance there will be anybody listening.

The only way to stand a chance of common sense is if every one who objected to this idea actually wrote in.

Backchat

Tell me if I'm wrong but 'don't need, don't want' spring to mind, apart from the cinema which will probably never be built, that's just to stop people moaning.

The apartments & housing no normal working person will be able to afford them.

Seen it all before.

Sara Thompson

No strong views on Admiral Park plans.

But can't see cinema happening. Who of the big companies would want to take on a 300-seat cinema?

On the other two, they have to go ahead.

The alternative is two derelict and ugly buildings.

PLP

If it involves demolishing the eyesore that is Sidney Vane House I'm all for it!

vic gamble

...Paul, I worked in Sydney Vane House a matter of months after it had been constructed...oh how we all praised the modern clean cut of it all, enjoying our modern environment, thinking we were the occupants of something innovative and truly refelecting today's choices....bit like hearing the first Stones album after years of hearing Des O'Connor.

But everyting unto itself folds in old age...and now I have to agree with you..it has the mark of Cain upon its sorry brow.Soon it will be the Mark of the Beast if something is not done quickly.

Guern abroad

The alternative is use this site for affordable housing. Why shouldn't people who are at the lower economic scale not have a home with a good view.

Ray

What view? Waitrose & B&Q carpark?

Guern

Great news on all three developments lets see them started and get on with it. All these people moaning they will lose their views, since when have you been entitled to a view.

Will be good to see the brewery site sorted out and bring life to that end of town, as for the Admiral park site great to think it will be finished at long last, Cobo will be good to see a old building looking smart again along the coast.

Stop putting heads in the stand and let the Island move forward we need it.

How many true Guerns are complaining none I suspect only those who like to believe they are Guerns.

A.J.

Perfect site for low cost housing. Forget the Cinemas and Offices,let's concentrate on the population's needs, and less on 'Wants.' And yes, for goodness sake widen that ridiculous exit road to the East. (well said Ray)

Ed

Why is there even a need to change "the face of Guernsey" ? What a disgruntled, unimaginative, empty-headed island we our if we find it impossible to create artificial amusement ! A saunter along the coast, a stroll in the lanes or an evening of playing mind-bending games ought to be just fine for any human.

The cliched yet true phrase "there is ample scope for a population of 65,000 people" doesn't seem to have been instilled in the minds of islander's ...

L'eree Lad

... or may I suggest a happy evening spent learning the correct use of the possessive apostrophe Ed?

vic gamble

...mind bending games Ed? Be a bit careful with that choice of words....you could end up with a police bust in the heady hours of morning light.

rosie

I gather that although Guernsey has a lot of office space, much of it is not considered suitable for the type of business we are currently dealing in. If this plan is given the go-ahead, maybe the space given for these modern office blocks should be matched by reverting the equivalent space in older office blocks in town into residential units.

Also, since most people seem to have identified traffic as a main concern of the additional development of this site, it would appear that it is high time that we should be smarter about how we plan to move people about. Expecting that every single person that will need to access the area should be accommodated for doing so individually in their own private car is just plain bonkers. I agree with Ray that building upwards (within reason) is a more economical use of space on an island with finite land, but with denser developments, the use of individual cars for every trip becomes even less desirable.

If there is to be any widening of the road, maybe it should be for a dedicated shuttle bus or tram that could zip back and forth between St Sampsons, Half Way, Admiral Park and St PP unhindered.

Gaz

Rosie,there is office space currently available in offices which have been constructed in the recent past such as Royal Chambers, Glategny Court, Mill Court, Regency Court and Admiral Park. There is also office space available in older offices which have been extensively renovated such as La Plaiderie Chambers and La Vielle Cour. What is probably needed is smaller, reasonably priced (if such a thing exists)offices. Which I very much doubt these proposed new offices will be.

Sara Thompson

@Ed not everyone ears a thesaurus for breakfast. Put it away and show the real you.

Oh, sadly it is.

Which is why we are not sheep and not everyone is amused by your style of entertainment, or by the dullest posts on any forum, anywhere, anytime.

Sorry there are no long words for you to consider!

Dani

You may not like what Ed has to say which is fair but the way he says it is up to him to decide how to communicate and he should be able to do so without ridicule.

Its what someone says that matters not how they say it. How would you like it if someone belittled your post because of the spelling error? Or not using a wide range of terms? And why would it really matter at the end of the day?

L'eree Lad

Dani,

You should not try to defend the indefensible.

In any debate the quality of communication is vital.

The power of any argument is diluted both by the poor use of language or, in Ed's case, a deliberately verbose and flowery style of delivery.

His chosen style calls into question the sincerity of all his posts and so undermines any message that he may be trying to put across.

I admit to tending not to read them at all.

Dani

L'eree lad

We will have to agree to disagree. I don't see the point of discrediting what someone says purely because how they say it.

Ed

You do not know how incorrect you actually are- I am fervent about all of the topics that I mention and will not allow anybody to influence me otherwise.

Spartacus

L'eree Lad

Ed's style of writing is verbose however I do not share your conclusion that this is deliberate or that his views are insincere. His communication style might be too demanding for you but nevertheless his views are clear.

Sara Thompson

And I made a typing error, sugar!

That should be eats, not ears. Of course.

Spartacus

Sara

I think your error was greater than a typo. You are not obliged to read Ed's posts and if you have nothing to say about his opinions but instead make derogatory remarks about his style when he is an obviously intelligent, considerate and highly thoughtful young man then your attitude marks you out as a troll.

L'eree Lad

Sparty,

I disagree, I think Ed is the biggest Troll on this forum.

However, his greatest achievement is to make you look foolish for thinking that his comments are at all genuine!

Spartacus

L'eree Lad

More fool you for thinking they are not.

JamieC

And the social housing quotient on this new development will be how much?

Or is that just reserved for the HTA's where private land owners have to make up the difference from their land value to get anything at all on their site?

But if you're in the 'property development club', whose membership influences zoning and planning possibility, you'll be ok.

A.J.

You've hit the nail on the head JamieC.

Sara

@Spartacus That's rich coming from a man whose views have dominated this forum for so long.

I stick by my view that Ed is using big words to impress, that's all.

Interestingly he hasn't responded.

Maybe he's the troll?

Ed

I don't think that is the case. More like I was so disgusted and didn't want to respond because my ire was difficult to express in words !

Spartacus

Sara

My views have dominated have they? Jolly good.

Ed is a Grammar sixth form student and possibly has mild aspergers which is known to cause verbosity. I for one feel he makes a rich contribution, adds to diversity on the forum and I enjoy reading his posts.

There is no excuse for bullying people because they are different from the way you are.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)

Ed

I would say definitely not for the latter point.

Dani

You two know each other?

Ed

Moreover, I don't believe that the words that I am using are even that complicated at all- for some of them such as 'otiose' or 'panacea' maybe.

Tom

How can the complex cause significantly traffic problems more than what there is already? - this is so obsurd.

Ed

In fact, I'd like you to produce some evidence that substantiates this theory that "Ed is using big words to impress". Integral to the continuity of a liberal society is the capacity of its inhabitants to appreciate and embrace the different ideas and beliefs that exist within it, of which may include a fondness for big words.

vic gamble

...Ed...I didn't find otiose or panacea hard to understand at all...indeed I was insouciant to all of that...it is Ed I find hard to understand.

Ed

To all of your interests I am not as troll but an individual who aims to stimulate further debate/discussion- I DO NOT operate to provoke strong emotions by posting inflammatory remarks. 'Unfortunately', some people enjoy using words that are somewhat exotic in nature.

And, for your information, nothing- not even the derision and disgruntlement displayed by some of you will deter me from producing further posts...

Ed

L'eree Lad

I know that you may disagree with me but I immediately recognised that apostrophe error once I had produced the post.