'We can all make errors of judgement'

A DEPUTY who parked in a space for disabled drivers was apologetic yesterday after he faced a barrage of criticism from islanders.

Deputy David Inglis

A DEPUTY who parked in a space for disabled drivers was apologetic yesterday after he faced a barrage of criticism from islanders.

Deputy David Inglis, pictured, said he was sorry he had parked in a spot reserved for Blue Badge holders at Health and Social Services’ corporate headquarters after he turned up late for a meeting.

By today, 130 comments had been left on the Guernsey Press’s Facebook page in reaction to the story.

‘Apologies all round, we can all make errors of judgement,’ he said on Twitter and later posted on Facebook that he was very sorry for his error of judgement.

‘It was unacceptable for me to park in a disabled parking space and I appreciate the upset this has caused’.

Comments for: "'We can all make errors of judgement'"

markB

Slapped legs and stand in the corner Inglis!!.... And remember!.. You’re a public servant and not above the law!!

Vincent

Unfortunately an apology doesn't quite cut it. As a states member who makes decisions for the good of the island to do that casts serious doubt on his "off-the-cuff decision-making" skills.

If that was one of us mere mortals we would have had a parking ticket / fine etc. I take it he got away with it?

Ray

Perhaps the disgraced Deputy David Inglis should take a little comfort from the fact that SOME,by no means all of the opprobrium will have sprung up merely because he IS a Deputy,and that similar photographs taken anywhere around the island where disabled bays are used inappropriately by able bodied drivers are unfortunately looked upon as the norm

Ted

As a deputy, of course, he will be more subject to scrutiny and opprobrium for bad behaviour. I don't see how he can take comfort from that. We have a right to expect Caesar's wife to be above reproach.

a voter

So that makes everything alright then does it?

I`m sure this man is laughing his head off and thinking, "If I make an apology this load of idiots will forget about it,"

WRONG, MY VOTE GOES ELSEWHERE AT THE NEXT ELECTION I CAN ASSURE YOU.

Davis

Watch out, guys! We've got a real bad-ass here!

Beanjar

One more indicator that our rulers consider themselves more important than the rest of us, even those with disabilities. We should never have started paying 'career politicians' when what the island actually needs is decent people who care for their community. £1000 a day and he can't even be bothered to get out of bed in time to park properly with the rest of us mortals. Disgraceful.

A.J.

As a 'servant' of the people of Guernsey,How many more important errrors is he likely to make? In my book Arrogance = Ignorance.

really

Shock!! Horror!! Someone parked in a disabled spot and are actually . . . not disabled!! What a scandle to hit the island, no one else has ever done that before. How will we ever live down the shame. Yawn, next . . .

Sam

really,

So you condone a deputy taking a disabled parking space for two and a half hours. You are obviously young and arrogent and perhaps one day may realise the need for that space to be available for a disabled person who may require it.

really

Sam

Sadly not young anymore, not very arrogant either, they both tend to go hand in hand, all I am saying is that just like many many other people in the island he has parked in a disabled space when he shouldnt have. You dont see a news story picturing every person doing this otherwise it would be a daily name and shame. This to me is a non story.

Guernzee

Agree with @really, hardly ground breaking news. Not the best move and rather unlucky to be photographed whilst committing the crime.....as really says, yawn next!

sarnia expat

But if you were a nurse, late on duty for example, and you parked in the "wrong" sort of parking space, you would be charged by der management £35. This man obviously thinks he's it, but he's not he's ...... you get the idea.

John

@really

You should be ashamed of your attitude towards disabled people as should Deputy inglis be.

It is your sort who think i will just park here in a disabled bay for an hour nobody will notice or care. Well some of us with disbaled relatives do care and I for one often challenge people for parking in disabled spaces.

When i do challenge I usually get a load of verbal threatening abuse but that is what i have come to expect from the sort of people who park in disabled bays rather than park 100 yards away and walk.

Really

@ John

Actually John, you dont know me, so I dont appreciate being labelled as a "sort" as it goes, I dont park in disabled spaces, nor do I park in parent and child spaces as my children at 8 and 10 are old enough to walk the 100 yards further to the shop. So please don't put me in that box, no need for your arrogance.

I am simply saying that many many people do use the disabled spaces when they could use a normal space and does it make headline worthy news? No it doesn't.

Gsy Gal

As a disabled person, I think IT does matter & is newsworthy ... I'd rather be able to walk 100 yards and back without collapsing. We need more people to take notice of this picture and THINK before they park in a disabled space to JUST NIP into this shop or that shop.

Neil Forman

Gsy Gal

Thank you for putting this into context!

Totally agree.

Herbert Roth

Unbelievable really. Not just that he actually parked in a disabled space, but that he actually thought no-one would get upset - did he not see the furore surrounding MP Andrew Mitchell when he was rude to a policeman in Downing St?

At least Deputy David's contrite about the whole thing.

Spartacus

Ok I'm going to make a controversial devils advocate comment.

Do disabled people have more rights than able bodies or equal rights?

How many disabled places are there in this vacinity? How many were being utilised at the time? How many disabled people were prevented from using HSSDs corporate service HQ that morning due to Deputy Ingliss parking in a space reserved especially for them in the event they might turn up?

I am absolutely in favour of rights for disabled people however able bodied people have rights too and if there were no ordinary spaces free then perhaps an able bodied person should be able to use a vacant disabled space?

Peter

Spartacus

That's just about the biggest load of drivel i have seen you write on a forum.

Spartacus

Peter

Is the view nice up there?

We need to be wary of PC taking over the world. Equality is the important thing, it is not about special treatment for certain groups its about allowing equal opportunity. The disabled cannot be sheltered from every problem which even an able bodied human being has to face, that is patronising.

Perhaps in the future public buildings will have good public transport links and no parking facilities at all.

Bill

Bullocks , the blue badge parking spaces are not there to give the disabled an advantage but equality. My disabled friend is unable to walk from the main car park so therefor utilising the nearby disabled spot is only levelling the playing field with someone, like Dep Ingles, who is I understand quite able to make the short walk from the main hospital car park. Who can say someone needs that spot five minutes after he parked there.

This is all about his lack of tact, his disrespect of the provision of assistance for the disabled, and this level of bad judgement seems to be far to prevellant amongst our elected leaders.

Then again we can always say sorry.. That fixes everything, sorry I paid my taxes late, sorry I drove to fast after drinking a bottle of whiskey, sorry I stole £2.6 million ... Sometimes a bigger statement needs to be made..

Spartacus

Bill

It is only leveling the playing field if there are spaces available for the able bodied. There is usually plenty of parking at the hospital but not at other places.

Deputy Ingliss only parked there because he was late. However, if there were at least two disabled spaces and one other space remained unused for the duration of his visit then you can be certain that his use of the space caused no problem.

Peter

Spartacus,

Your attitude is really sad on this one. Blow your disability, i'm alright attitude places you on a completly different lever to most humans.

Neil Forman

Spartacus

UNBELIEVABLE!

The disabled places are put their so people with mobility problems don't have to struggle from the main car parks.

Deputy Inglis just parked in the closest space, I cannot see that all spaces were taken. He should be held to task for this.

If you want equality, why did he not receive a ticket? Anybody else would have. As a Deputy he should be seen to be obeying laws / rules, not flaunting them. His excuse was very weak.

As for being wary of PC taking over the world, did you not rant at me a while ago for saying I don't do PC?

Spartacus

Neil

So you want to create a role for a public sector worker to go around patrolling disabled spaces and issuing tickets now do you? backtracker.

guern abroad

Totally surprised the posts by Spartacus and not in a positive way either. Shocked and quite frankly disapointed from someone who banged on so mcuh about supporting mental health and low income, would appear to be 'as long as able bodied'.

It does not matter whether all the spaces were taken or not, he was able bodied and should not uses a disabled space for what ever reason!

Neil Forman

Spartacus

Do not take this the wrong way but I am getting concerned about you lately.

For someone who I deemed as pretty switched on when I started posting on this site you are getting a bit unravelled lately.

You seem to be going against the trend of thinking which does make a healthy debate but you are going way to far. This is one clear instance.

Are you ok? Please do not take this the wrong way, I am genuinely concerned. I like a good debate but I have seen a massive change of attitude of late.

Spartacus

Neil

Thank you for your concern and for the compliment. I stand by my contribution to this thread which I believe adds perspective, context and value. Perhaps you have not had a chance to think about it for longer than a nano second before submitting your typical knee jerk response. Please don't take that the wrong way.

Neil Forman

Spartacus

We would not need to create another public job to check the parking spaces, we already have traffic wardens.

I don't see where you get backtracker from.

This is not a knee jerk reaction, these parking spaces are there for a reason, certainly not for a person in his position to use because he is late for a meeting.

really

For once I agree ! It's PC gone mad

Phil

Go and troll somewhere else big nose

Spartacus

Phil

You are a troll as you have nothing at all to say you just hurl insults.

Phil

Nothing to say? I've never been accused of that before!

I didn't realise you were so sensitive, have you really got a big nose?

Proudlocal

Spartacus I am stunned. An enable bodied person has the ability, because of their mobility, to park elswhere and walk. A disabled person who arrives at the hospital may well not have the ability to walk far and may miss their own appointment through this selfish act. We are talking about equality and inclusion. Just because the space is free at a certain point in time does not mean that somebody with needs five minutes or two hours later will require access to the space. How would you feel if I parked my car in the forecourt of a filling station and denied you the abilty to fill your car with petrol? I suspect you would not be happy.

Spartacus

Proudlocal

Disabled people have the ability to park elsewhere and use their wheelchairs to get to their location too. My point is about equality as opposed to special treatment.

Any person, whether able bodied or disabled can miss an appointment due to no parking availability. The disabled person can park in an ordinary space if the disabled spaces are in use but not vice versa.

How many disabled spaces should there be in each location?

B&B

Yes Spartacus, because everybody registered as disabled has a wheelchair!!!

Spartacus

B&B

How do they get through the long corridors within the hospital if they cannot walk from a parking space?

How do disabled public transport users cope?

Proudlocal

Spartacus your understanding of the term 'disabled' shows your complete lack of thought and empathy towards those less fortunate than many others. Many disabled badge holders do not need a wheelchair many have heart or respiratory problems meaning they cannot walk far, others with complex medical needs have been given access because the medics feel it appropriate. Disabled people need special arrangements in order to allow them to have 'equal opportunity' and cope in the same way as those who do not have a disability.

Were you supporting and cheering all our great disabled Olympians recently ?

Many of whom have been given extra support in order that they can demonstrate their character and achievements. Would you prefer us to quietly forget about the disabled as previous generations did or should we celebrate their achievements?

John

You should be ashamed of yourself.

You would soon feel different if you were disabled.

Spartacus

Proudlocal

The paralympics certainly sheds a different perspective on the misnomer "disabled" good point. Disabled does not mean incapable. We certainly should celebrate their achievements. Absolutely.

I have nothing against disabled badge holders whatever gave you that impression? I support equality. I support special arrangements for the disabled to provide equal opportunities. I just asked a valid set of questions at 11.08am which no one has answered.

Spartacus

John

You do not know if I am able or disabled.

Peter

Spartacus,

many don't.

guern abroad

Shock again!

Becuase if you can not walk far once in the reception at the hospital a porter will take you to where you need in a wheel chair they provide.

No one.

"heart or respiratory problems " That is not in my opinion disabled. Would you consider a young person with a broken leg disabled ? Yet the broken leg would have more difficulty exiting a vehicle.

The more I read this thread the more I can see Spartacus comment. 99% of you have jumped on the bandwagon and not looked at the questions he/she has raised.

I am not disabled, however I did push my grandfather around in a wheelchair for many years. So yes I have some experience.

CSR

No One,

Heart and respiratory problems are a valid basis for an application for a Disabled Persons Permit, the GP would decide on the severity of the individual's condition with regard to their application for such a permit.

A quick look online for a definition of 'disability' resulted in this... "referring to people having either physical or mental impairments", therefore a person with a broken leg would have the right to apply for a temporary disabled person's permit as they are .... 'disabled' (obviously certain conditions apply in those cases and each application is assessed on its own merits).

The rationale behind providing disabled persons parking spaces (in public areas) is to assist where possible, disabled persons to gain access to shopping areas (in general)and also to reduce the walking distance from their residence to their vehicle (if they are a driver).

Not unreasonable by most people's standards I would think.

Hope this helps.

markB

Spartacus......and if there’s no ambulance parked in front of Accident and Emergency unloading some poor unfortunate soul then why not park there too!!

CSR

Sproutsrus

Perhaps you should do the homework yourself and come back with the evidence. No right minded individual could possibly condone Mr Inglis' behaviour. Whether you agree or otherwise with the reasoning behind the provision of disabled parking bays, they are there for the use of such persons... by law. I sincerely hope that if you query the 'rights' of disabled persons and park in an unused diabled parking bay in future, you don't bleat when you are fined for your 'devil advocate's' role.

Spartacus

SCKR

I raised valid questions concerning the rationale for provision of specially allocated parking bays for disabled people. I did not condone any law breaking.

markB

I fail to see what was valid about it?... you already knew the answer.

Toby

OK I'll have a stab at answering your questions

1 - yes the disabled do appear to have more "rights" - because special provision is made to give them access to the rights the rest of us enjoy that otherwise they couldn't - so in balance it's a level playing field

2 -No idea how many spaces there are - but whether they are all being used at any instant is irrelevant - what is relevant however is if any normal spaces were available. I also don't know if anyone was inconvenienced - but again not the point. If it is illogical to maintain parking spaces because they are not constantly in use then, logically, we should remove all the parking spaces around the island that lie empty for long periods overnight / during the day / at weekends .....

I am absolutely in favour of rights for private property owners however the general public have rights too and if there were no public parking spaces free then perhaps a member of the public should be able to use a private parking space if it is empty ? ( if you live near me it would really help if I could park on your driveway when I'm pushed for time and there are no spaces on street ..... )

Toby

As George Orwell may have put it

" We can all make errors of judgement, but some of us make more errors of judgement than others "

Sue

He apologises for his error of judgement, easy to say sorry after he has been caught out.

Deputy David inglis is a public figure and the public expect an example to be set by public figures.

Sam from the previous forum on this subject is right. Deputy Inglis should be appear before the states members code of conduct, he has brought the states into disrepute and I copy that code from Sam's previous post:

STATES MEMBERS CODE OF CONDUCT SEC 3 & 8

Members’ Conduct

3. The primary duty of Members is to act in the public interest. In so doing Members have a duty on all occasions to act in accordance with their oaths, and in accordance with the public trust placed in them.

8. Members shall at all times conduct themselves in a manner which will tend to maintain and strengthen the public‟s trust and confidence in the integrity of the States of Deliberation and never undertake any action which would bring the States, or its Members generally, into disrepute.

Fair

I think this shows he's just human and makes mistakes like everybody else...Im sure he's not the first person to have done something wrong in their life and to personally know him I know for a fact that he's not laughing his head off as "a voter" thinks. Also, yes he was running late, and the reason for this is that he was at a prior meeting at La Mare School which went for longer than expected and not in bed as "Bean jar" states. Yes, it was a stupid thing to do but I think attacking someone on a personal level is an awful thing to do aswel....so maybe all you opionated Guernsey people need to get off the rock for a bit and get a taste of the real world.

bcb

"so maybe all you opionated Guernsey people need to get off the rock for a bit and get a taste of the real world".

Oh shut up

Sue

Fair

This is the real world, and a public figure's blatant, knowing abuse of a disabled person's parking place for two and a half hours should be made an example of, because he holds a position of public trust.

Scarlett

'I think attacking someone on a personal level is an awful thing to do aswel….so maybe all you opionated Guernsey people need to get off the rock for a bit and get a taste of the real world' people...'

But it's OK for you to make rude, generalised xenophobic insults about all Guernsey people, based on a few comments on here (which you've somehow worked out represents the entire population), is it?

Your comments say way more about you than the people you're insulting.

How do people like you manage to turn everything into a local basing opportunity, anyway? I mean, is it an intellectual skill that we locals don't possess, or merely a reflection of the fact you only have one tedious, facile opinion that explains everything that happens over here, that you repeat ad nauseum, like some sort of mentally challenged parrot?

John

It was not a mistake. he knew exactly what he was doing.

JBee

Perhaps a donation to an appropriate charity might make his apology more 'acceptable'?

Jim

Is this really the most important thing you critics have the time to think about - I think there are a few hundred more issues facing Guernsey...education, health...

soph

A poor excuse for using a disabled car space

How many disabled could not park due to that one occupied? Lets here from you!!

Silly drivers even ignore No Entry signs for new Co-Op setup in St Martins. They should be warned reported and banned too!!!

Guernzee

Ere, I'm a man and I never make mistakes! Just ask my wife she will tell you! :)

JBee

Have just seen in the Press that he has asked John Gollop to nominate a suitable charity for him to make a donation in recognition of his 'mistake'.

Dictionary definition of mistake - "an action or an opinion that is not correct, or that produces a result that you did not want" - bet he didn't want a press photographer there as a result. Fair play though lets hope it's a sizeable donation.

can of worms

Next you'll get me started on people with no kids or old kids parking in child and parent parking, does my head in!

can of worms

ps i've never and would never ever park in a disabled space so don't say we all make errors.

Rufus

Good job nothing serious happened. He'd be hanging from the nearest tree.

@suitable charity for him to make a donation in recognition of his ‘mistake’.@

Ha ha ha ha ha ha!! For a parking infraction? I swear, society is severely out of kilter.

John

It is not a parkinginfraction. Disabled bays are there for a reason. We are basically a caring society who understand that disabled people need to be able to park closer to facilities. Deputy Inglis showed no reagrd for the disabled sign and did not care that he might cause a disabled person distress.

Spartacus

John

There are plenty of things which cause disabled people distress and with due respect I think that availability of parking is a relatively minor issue in relation to disabled people's needs in this "caring society".

There are bigger fish to fry. Inadequate laws, inadequate facilities, lack of treatment, lack of affordability, lack of basic health equity for 10,000 people and you are worried about a parking space which may or may not have caused a moment of distress.

Les Pets

Take him to court and prosecute him. A person in the public eye should be punished in a highly visible and harsh manner. One rule for them and as usual another for us .Very George Orwell.

jeanieweanie3

Totally agree he is only human and we all make mistakes...if people want him to apologies more fully how about making him stand out in the rain and personally assist disabled users into the building...would that help! Just posing the question? This sort of thing happens all over the island, doesn't it...just spare a thought for others!

leave a reply

Personally i don't want to pay someones wages with such a low moral code. I don't know about other people but i'd never do this

Platinum Law

I think it is time to lay off Deputy Inglis. As "really" says above, this is now a non-story, move on and worry about more important issues concerning the Island. Yes, he shouldn't have parked in a disabled space. It was an error of judgement and I'm sure he regrets doing it. Negative comments on this forum will not help the matter. I imagine that 50+% of forum users have no idea what Mr Inglis' role entails. Do they know this man aside from the negative comments printed in the Guernsey Press? I didnt think so.

We are all guilty of 'social wrongs' from time to time, i.e creeping above the speed limit. I'm sure we have all done that inadvertently on at least one occasion. Is speeding worse than parking in a disabled space? Some will say Yes, some will say No. Deputy Inglis got caught and is paying for it through negative commentary on this forum and in our local press. We should not be quick to judge Deputy Inglis on this one indiscretion. He did wrong, he has apologised, enough is enough. People should look at themselves and think: "am I whiter than white" before posting negative comments on here about an otherwise hard working deputy and upstanding member of the Guernsey community.

Len

Platinum Law,

I can forgive mistakes, we all make them.

This was a caculated deliberate act that deprived a disabled person of that parking space for two and a half hours.

It was not a mistake and if he can make a deliberate ,caculated decision like that then it tends to show a lot more about the thinking of that person.

In his position as a Deputy, he lets the whole States down. "Sorry," slips too easily off the tongue.

becks

Just as a point of clarification.

When I applied and received a blue card I checked with the police station and was told that if disabled parking spaces were all occupied then I could park in a normal parking space, FOR UP TO THREE HOURS, if I displayed both my blue card and a clock showing time of arrival.

I have used this privilege in the area around The Town Church on three occasions whilst attending appointments,(I believe these are half hour parking areas, so advantage disabled drivers.)

NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW THAT!

Gsyman

Mr Inglis if you take a disabled person's space you can take their disability too

Cynic

I have read all the above and not once has compensation been mentioned, after all some of you seem so badly affected. Hurry if you want the cheque in time for Christmas!

Backchat

When the finance industry leaves people like this will go too!

Scarlett

It's not the law but my conscience that stops me from ever parking in disabled spaces....

perhaps a lack of conscience would enable me to park in 'em.....

and become a politician.

Sarah

I think it is out of order if it was a member of the public we would of had a parking tickets and a slap on the wrist. He sould no better makes my blood boil.

guern abroad

'Apologies all round, we can all make errors of judgement'

That quote looks an admission that it was a calculated decision to park in a disabled bay. That is just plain bad.

Platinum Law

LEN: clearly he intended to park in the disabled space, I am not disputing that. The point I am trying to put across is that Deputy Inglis made a poor decision in the spur of the moment. This 'incident' should not be allowed to tarnish his otherwise good character.

len

Platinum Law,

In this day and age anyone who has public office and is expected to set an example by his/her actions in life is going to be taken to task if they step out of line and they will have to face the consequences.

In this case there is no excuse for what was done. It would in fact be better if he appeared quickly before the States members Code of Conduct Panel received a punishment and that would be an end to it.

People at the moment are just expressing their disgust at what happened and that will continue until there is a conclusion.

Scarlett

Who knows his character is 'otherwise good', Platinum?.

unless you have intimate longstanding knowledge of the man, of course....?

Spartacus

Parking spaces are a premium resource and in this case a public asset. I think we should be thinking harder and more laterally about appropriate solutions to the problems of all the disabled, not just disabled badge holders who have use of a car, some of whom are visiting patients in the hospital, some of whom are accompanying relatives to appointments etc.

In the case of parking facilities at public buildings we should be thinking about the needs of all users including availability of parking but more importantly, suitable public transport options, for everyone, not just disabled badge holders who drive.

How much would paid parking at the hospital raise? Would you rather have parking facilities or medical facilities?

Tim

Spartacus,

Have you just lost the plot?

Your comment is totally irrellivent to the current theme.

Scarlett

Sparty's trying to deflect from her previous ridiculous remarks (9), Tim, in the hope we've forgotten.

If she didn't have a previous career in politics, I'll eat my hat, with cheese.

Spartacus

Scarlett

We can always rely on you for a comment on a comment on a comment ;-)

No deflection intended. Only a few people have considered this matter for more than a second, it is a storm in a parking spot.

The problems of the disabled are rarely even given a second thought by any but those who are closely affiliated to someone with special needs. Parking spaces do nothing to solve the problems and are merely a token PC gesture. I hope I have made some people think a tiny bit harder about this.

Deputy Ingliss is this week's whipping boy that's all there is to it. Totally disproportionate outrage from people in regard to the incident and in regard to my comments.

Avec fromage! Hope your false teeth are up to the job - get munching :-)

Toby

"Parking spaces do nothing to solve the problems and are merely a token PC gesture."

Really ? Having a space right outside the entrance to somewhere, rather than miles away in the car park, does nothing to solve the problems of someone with reduced mobility ?

Like Neil, I'm begining to worry about you Spartacus ... unless of course you are just trolling around here for your own amusement ....

Scarlett

Sparty. You invariable take the contentious 'devil's advocate' stance regardless, because, IMO, you like to have an argument, and are capable of going on and on til you have the last word, then claim you've 'won'...

some might say this clinches your gender, at least, but heaven forfend, not I...

This time, your quite frankly ridiculous stance (as many have already noted here) is a rambling diatribe about 'able bodied people's right' versus 'disabled people's rights' and how isn't it OK for an able bodied person to use a disabled space as it's free (?)

Well, no, it isn't, legally, morally or any other way you paint it, Sparty, and though you will continue to argue black is white and come up with a variety of arguments that deflect from your original inane points, it still doesn't make you - or Mr Inglis - right.

I recall that when first tackled on this, Mr Inglis showed pretty much total disregard for the nature of what he'd done, and it wasn't til there was a considerable negative reaction to his thoughtless deed that he decided he should show some conscience about it.

For the record I would never, ever park in a disabled space if it was 'free' as I, like many, have a conscience, and do not know if a disabled person will need it - neither did Mr Inglis.

The outcry is disproportionate, perhaps, but his initial reaction was disappointing unapologetic, and on the positive side, the stance you have taken regarding this shows you up as the (dare I say it) demi troll I think you truly are.

...perhaps the imminent dismissal of the HSSD Board through their incompetence is just a little too close to home, so you feel driven to defend their every move?

Spartacus

Toby

I seem to recall that you are a personal friend of Neil Forman? He is the one who has been a bit unravelled since I mentioned his tribunal case which I found on the web. Perhaps you should be worried about him?

Disabled badge holders are a very small group of people. Of course we should try to accommodate their needs within reason and have measures to promote inclusivity.

I do not agree however that special parking spaces are the best way to do this and they are by no means essential to enable disabled badge holders to access the services they need. There are many options and better solutions to this.

The general public is a much larger group and includes plenty of people with special needs and disabilities, albeit they do not qualify for a disabled badge. We should try to accommodate everyone's needs equally and be careful that we do not give special facilities to some minority groups at the expense of others, who might be equally distressed if they are unable to access the services they require.

My comment no 33 was sound, if you think having disabled parking spaces lying empty everywhere is a perfect solution to anyone's problems you are welcome to disagree with me, I have no problem with that, but if you are troll hunting you should be pointing your finger at Tim, Scarlett and your chum Neil.

Spartacus

Scarlett

Yes I will admit I like a good debate - or argument, whatever. There's no crime in that I think it is a good thing if people think about stuff and you are no shrinking violet yourself, so come on.

I think there are circumstances where it is morally perfectly OK for someone who does not have a disabled badge to use a disabled space. Legally it may be forbidden but I believe there are some circumstances which even the law would forgive.

There are plenty of people who are not able bodied but do not qualify for a disabled badge, had that occurred to you? Or is that too grey even for you?

I never said Mr Ingliss was right but he didn't commit murder it was a minor faux pas! That's my opinion like it or lump it.

I'm not sure exactly where HSSD corporate HQ is (I imagine somewhere on the PEH site) or how frequently those spaces are needed do you happen to know?

Neil Forman

Spartacus

I have not been unravelled since you mentioned my tribunal. I have read the online version and it is not the full document.

As I have said, I cannot comment on anything about the tribunal at this moment in time. I will be happy to in the future.

You obviously find it intriguing but I have nothing to hide.

If anyone would like to see the document referred to you can find it here:

http://www.gov.gg/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=2830&p=0

Not really that exciting.

Scarlett

Sparty, now trying to deflect Neil's comments with references to his tribunal?

Seriously grasping at straws here, still, better than admitting you're wrong, like you could ever be.

Hoping beyond hope you don't discover I wore the same pair of socks two days in a row once, or that will undoubtedly be dragged out to somehow tarnish my character and thus my comments.

ps. you're still wrong.

Spartacus

Scarlett

Are you referring to Neil's comments where he said "don't take this the wrong way but I'm genuinely concerned about you"?

Coming from typically "misguided" Neil the way I took it was as the joke it was intended to be. I would not expect him to deliberately make a low jibe to try to tarnish my character or you would have pulled HIM up on that surely?

He makes out he has never made a mistake and is whiter than white and because he did not understand my questions and debate in this matter he is suggesting to the public that there must be something wrong with me! Well there might well be something wrong with me but who would he be to judge or question it in such a condescending manner? Maybe there is something wrong with him eh?

My reference to his tribunal is just a reminder that we all make errors of judgement, faux pas and have disagreements as its part of life's rich pattern, not a reflection of character. It is useful information because of his vilification of the civil service generally whom he seems to forget are just people with employee rights just like the rest of us.

I acknowledge there seems to be something in my comments which has caused you and others to get up on your high horses. So maybe it is worth just clarifying that I have NOT said anything detrimental towards disabled people and their right to inclusion and equality. Maybe something has been read between the lines which is not there? Or is it just me?

I'm sure Deputy Inglis is not the villain he is painted in these comments. I have taken a guess that if he had decided not to park in the disabled space that day he would have been even later to the meeting, missing important government business requiring his contribution, and instead he would have been driving round in circles for a very long time like most of us do in Guernsey regularly adding CO2 to the atmosphere.

My other guess is that not one disabled person turned up at HSSD HQ while David Inglis' car occupied that special spot and if they had done there would have been a second special spot (there always is) which would have been kept vacant for their convenience.

I could well be wrong about this and would stand corrected if I am. After all that was all I was asking in my initial post which seems to have been misinterpreted and caused so much fuss.

Neil Forman

Spartacus

My ' don't take this the wrong way ' post was admittedly a bit tongue in cheek. I feel your posts have taken on a different persona of late. You seem to be going against most people just for the sake of it. This was in no means a low jibe to tarnish your character, I do not work like that. If I have something to say, I will say it. I may be blunt but I will say what I think. Mst people respect that of me.

Maybe there is something wrong with me, I keep biting on your comments;-))

I take all things on the chin, you can try to tarnish my character I don't mind. I am very easy going and will not rise. I post under my name and anybody who disagrees is welcome to stop me in the street for a chat, I will listen to a reasonable argument.

I do not make myself whiter than white, if I make a mistake I will admit it. There was a post a while ago about a young person turning a car over. I recounted one of my experiences when I was younger and admitted that I was driving like an idiot from the outset. Nobody is perfect, I am far from it. I am just posting my opinions.

My tribunal was not an error of judgement and is very different to the Civil Service issue. That is all I can legally say at this point.

I do not agree that being late for a meeting is an acceptable excuse for parking in a disabled spot, I don't know how many parking places there are at the PEH but I am willing to bet that the amount for the disabled is an insignificant number compared to the rest.

Spartacus

Neil

That's garbage, I don't "go against most people just for the sake of it", I state my opinions irrespective of whether it is a populist viewpoint and have done so from my first post on this forum. You know this due to my very long debates in relation to the education fiasco so don't imply I have changed.

You are blunt and people respect that of you if they agree with you, I am equally blunt and people do not respect that if they disagree. The upshot is any fool can make a populist comment and get lots of people to agree but it takes a different kind of character to see a different angle and have the courage to make people think a bit more laterally.

Your tribunal showed that you have double standards when it comes to public sector workers and the tribunal did not uphold your claim.

I don't think I would be brave enough to stop you in the street Neil :-) I think if TIG had a christmas party I would need to come along in full gladiator armour!

David Ingliss was late for the meeting because his previous meting at LMDC school ran over time. He said in the press that there was nowhere else to park at Duchess of Kent house.

He might have been able to park elsewhere at the hospital but it might have taken a while to find a space and then more time to walk from there. If no space could be found he would have had to go home and miss the important meeting when there was at least one unused space right there where he needed to be on official government business.

If Prince Charles was visiting the Duchess of Kent house they would have let his chauffeur park there for the two hours and no one would have said a word.

Ray

In hindsight next time the disgraced David Inglis finds himself in that position he might decide to simply park up behind his Minister and block him in ... whoever that Minister might be

St Marcouf

The outcry on this forum is disproportionate and unnecessarily opprobrious - it highlights the ugly nature of UK-driven political correctness.

I wonder how many disabled persons were actually inconvenienced in the 2.5 hours that Deputy Inglis parked in the space? Probably not even one. Certainly nobody came to any harm.

Meanwhile, many hundreds of pedestrians and drivers are inconvenienced and put in danger every day by selfish and idle people who commit the far greater misdemeanour of parking willy nilly on pavements and highways, causing wanton obstructions and traffic jams all over the island.

Indeed, I bet there are lots of posters here who have parked on the pavement or highway whilst they picked up their fish and chips or called in at somebody's house or collected their children - how they may justify such behaviour whilst castigating someone for the misuse of a disabled parking bay which might affect nobody at all, I do not know.

jack

st marcrouf - I agree with you - the posts on this forum would be funny if not so self righteous - absolute drivel

Sam

St Marcouf,

you say:

"I wonder how many disabled persons were actually inconvenienced in the 2.5 hours that Deputy Inglis parked in the space? Probably not even one. Certainly nobody came to any harm."

What a totally irrellivent comment to the selfish attitude taken by the Deputy, who apparently couldn't have cared less whether they were inconvenienced of not.

St Marcouf

Was he any more selfish than the person who parks on, for example, Fort Road at 8:15 in the morning causing a long tailback of traffic as cars have to wait their turn to manoeuvre around him?

No, he was far less selfish because he didn't inconvenience anyone, and barely risked inconveniencing anyone if members of the disabled public rarely have cause to visit HSSD's corporate headquarters.

Sam

St Marcouf,

No, he probably wasn't, but he is a public figure in Guernsey society. He chose that position and we the public voted him in and expected him, as a public figure, to set an example. He didn't, it wasn't even a mistake, it was a deliberate act.

So sorry St Marcouf, if you get caught out deliberately flouting a disabled parking sign and you are a public figure, don't expect anything less than the comments made above.

I’m sure if the police had caught your parker on the Fort rd, he would have been reported for interrupting the free flow of traffic and appeared in court. He just wasn't caught.

peter

I always respect the disabled spaces but not the mother and child ones. Why should they have special treatment? To me the woman’s place is at home looking after the man and children not gallivanting around the island dragging the children behind them.

Len

Peter,

Which decade do you come from?

Sarnia expat

Absolutely. Let the hunter gatherer go forth and hunt and gather, Keep us in the luxury we would all like to be in rather than have to hold down two jobs! Gosh, I bet Mrs, Peter is as pleased as punch to have such a thoughtful partner as you, especially as you obviously do all the shopping. bless......

for anyone who may be in doubt. Peters post is likely to be ironic, as is mine. i know we havent had irony around these parts for some time, but give it a go....

PLP

Peter - when you're out doing the shopping with the children don't forget those spaces aren't just for mums, dads can use them too!

Bovvered

I feel a little bit sorry for Dave, he just happened to get `caught’ on camera doing something that others do every day!

Deputy or not, its not `right’ but people do it, its annoying but hey so are a lot of other things!

As a full time wheelchair user, unable to walk at al, I often feel aggrieved at able people using disabled person spaces, particularly as I need to get out of the drivers side, remove my wheelchair, and I need enough space to do so.

So, if all disabled spaces are full in town/shops/bridge etc, and there are no `end’ spaces, where someone will not park close to me, I have to go home!

Annoying, yes. But, that’s life!

People will always break the rules and little can be done about it.

L'eree Lad

There may be an element of over-reaction here when you compare the issue with all those other serious problems Guernsey and its elected representatives must tackle.

Nevertheless, we rightly set high standards for those in public office. People like Mr. Inglis have been voted in due to the public's wish to see change at the top. Instead he makes an error of judgment that makes him look as bad as those he has replaced.

So, not a sacking offence then but let us hope that he has got the message loud and clear - we expect better.

Graham Johns

I'm afraid most of you are completely missing the point. This Deputy is well paid to attend meetings ON TIME. He has not only had the temerity to turn up late, but then parks in the first available spot - a disabled one. These spaces are very few and are there for the minority amongst us who are unable to walk large distances. Doing this could cause pain to such a person and is morally (and lawfully) wrong. This by a Deputy.

Perhaps some of you should go out, find some friends and have proper discussion with those friends, rather than resort to putting inane comments on here in a desperate attempt to communicate with somebody.

My first and last comment on this and only my second ever on any subject.

Ray

Graham

Just trying to tempt you to come back on TIG for a third time! but if the sinned against space was not listed within the roads or public parking spaces ordinances the deed was not actually unlawful,although in most people's eyes it was certainly immoral

Same thing applies at Waitrose for instance. You would be frowned on for parking in a parent and toddler space ( if you weren't a parent with a toddler)but they can't touch you for it

Must sign off now.Time to go out and look for some friends.Better try to make friends with the Irish I suppose since Deputy Roger Domaille has now upset one of them

Sam

Graham Johns,

I think you will find if you read all the comments on this forum that the vast majority agree with you.

The inane comments which turn up on forums like this are from people with little little knowledge of anything and are usually ignored.

It's no excuse but just for accuracy, i believe deputy Inglis had been attending another states meeting and rushed straight from that one to this one, so his lateness can be explained. As I say , no excuse for deliberatly taking a disabled space for 2.5 hrs.

Toby

The point everybody is really missing is this ...

What is the huge hidden crisis going on at La Mare that Deputy Inglis felt was more important than attending, on time, a meeting to discuss a £2.5 million overspend, the cancelling of operations, the closure of wards, and a vote of no confidence of a board in charge of over £100 million pounds of taxpayers money every year ...

Spartacus

Toby

Good point, in hindsight he should not have attended the La Mare meeting, which was surely a commitment he made before the emergency HSSD meeting. Instead he should have cancelled La Mare at short notice and walked to his place of work for his urgent and very important meeting. Graham Johns would therefore not be outraged but would have been grateful to him for keeping his disabled space free just in case Graham Johns felt like popping in to HSSD HQ for no reason whatsoever that day.

Eh

Toby you are giving him Fargo much credit!2 further minutes late would not make a difference and why was he late anyway if it was so important!!!!!

I would only do this in a medical emergency. We all have important stuff on but we would not all do this!

Pete

Only sorry he got caught...FACT