FTP debate: deputies say where they stand

FEWER than half of States members have pledged their unequivocal support for its big savings initiative ahead of its make-or-break debate this week.

FEWER than half of States members have pledged their unequivocal support for its big savings initiative ahead of its make-or-break debate this week.

A snapshot survey by the Guernsey Press, asking how each deputy felt about the Financial Transformation Programme, showed that 21 were fully behind it.

But while 20 were broadly in favour of the programme many were willing to consider changes to some of its crucial aspects.

Only two deputies said they would not support the FTP.

Four politicians were unavailable to comment.

States champion for the savings programme, Treasury and Resources minister Deputy Gavin St Pier, urged deputies to focus on the problem at hand – the £31m. hole in States finances.

  • Part one of the Guernsey Press survey is in today's newspaper, with part two published tomorrow.

Comments for: "FTP debate: deputies say where they stand"


Worried that the civil service looks at savings as reducing services to the taxpayer who foots the bill, rather than reducing overpaid under performing management and delivering efficiencies.

And the message sort it out or the income tax rate will need to go up, is hardly going to bother those on a cushy number.

Basically saying carry on as you are bleeding us dry with your incompetence muggins will foot the bill.



The public sector workforce has risen by around 20% in a period when the population has only risen by around 5%.

Those figures need to be verified as they were presented in a way which makes it impossible to confirm them 100%, but this seems to be the main area to focus on.

Are we doing more tasks than are necessary? Are we trying to deliver a Rolls Royce service when an Audi will suffice? Is the public sector workforce working to anything like capacity?


Any deputy who doesn't get squarely behind the FTP needs to

re-consider their position as a representative of the people of Guernsey who voted them into office if they can't grasp the seriousness of cutting costs within the SOG.

Every single states member new damn well that this was going to be one hell of term with tough decisions having to be made when they put themselves forward for election last year so there are NO EXCUSES now

for trying to derail the programme.

STOP finding excuses and START doing the job you're all getting paid very well to do. We didn't vote for you to protect the interests of the civil service. You are all getting paid by the people of guernsey to represent

US and look after OUR best interests.

Now just bloody well get on with it!!

Davey West

This is not a reply to Forest, it's a confirmation from Jersey ( in my opinion ) that Forest speaks the truth. Any Guernsey politician that does not get behind FTP does not understand their responsibility to the Guernsey people.

The chief executives of states departments have a duty to run their departments in an efficient and cost effective way. Yet they empire build and who in Guernsey is checking that departments are doing a good or great job within budget and being run to a top level standard - who ?

It is so easy to spend other peoples money, politicians should be safe guarding every tax pound spent. How many civil servants at the last meeting, how many were actually needed was anything achieved ?

Lets look at wonderful Jersey, can you believe some of your politicians want to learn, copy and take lessons from us.

Lets try Jersey's public sector wage bill, for an Island of a mere 45 square miles,

£328,000,000 including s/s and pension contributions. Yes £328 million.

End of - and end of Jersey as we sink slowly, don't follow in our footsteps.

Davey West


Many Deputies and Departments manifest a disturbing inability to understand the words "cut spending". it is not just a question of saving costs, it involves reducing benefits and services. It also involve cuting staff and programs.

There are distubing signs that the lust for spending, defending nonsensical subsidies, and cadillac or 'gold brick' projects continues to domnate the attitudes of many Deputies and senior Civil Servants.

If the Assembly fails, again, to live up to its responsibilities the future stability of Guernsey government and its finances will be called in question.

Island Wide Voting

The only thing that will guarantee that FTP will work is to dig out one of the many published pie charts which show what percentage of the Tax take each Department receives annually and for the CM and Treasury to TELL each department that this year’s pie is X minus 31M, and dish out the pie at the same percentage rate of that smaller amount

That would stop all this pathetic hand wringing and pussyfooting around with what appears to be purely voluntary and begrudging attempts to make the required savings

Any Department which finds that it has overspent will have to face a motion of no confidence and will need to produce some very strong arguments to prove that everything possible was done to stay within their reduced budget


Ray, I wish we had some old school Guernseymen like you in the states instead of these pussys we have to listen to on a daily basis bleating on about all the reasons why they can't do anything.


Island Wide Voting

Sorry I disagree. This must be done in a strategic way to ensure essential services are protected. Health, SSD and Education for example cannot afford cuts which would effect people's well being and educational outcomes.

Dave Jones


I think you are being a little disingenuous to the vast majority of Deputies who are fully signed up to the FTP, as yesterdays press clearly illustrated.

The ones who are questioning the programme are simply asking whether it is achievable in the timeframe planned. That is a perfectly legitimate question as it is their departments that have to deliver the savings without effecting front line services.

I have absolutely no doubt it will sail through the States on Wednesday. I also think that there should be a son of FTP and that we should continue to slim down the bureaucratic machine.


Dave Jones

I agree with you however there are clearly some major problems with the FTP for example the process seems to be consuming precious staff resources while savings are slow. All the problems need to be thrashed out openly and then solved.


Dave I make no apologies for the way I personally feel about the states in general which is fuelled by the fact that too many deputies appear to be more interested in posturing, debating and amending policies

rather than putting their differences aside and working together for the greater good of the island.

You CAN make the FTP a success without cutting services by removing the swaithes of upper and middle management that aren't on the front line and don't actually make meaningful contribution to the process of delivering public services.

The problem you have is that your senior civil servants are protecting their own personal interests above the publics which is why states departments have made such a half arsed attempt to deliver real savings.

PS. For the record I don't consider you a Pussy ;)


I still think many miss the point.

Removing the latest elected deputy from x department because they are still spending money for fun achieves nothing.

Making the incompetent multi tiered management structure in the civil service actually accountable.

Getting rid of "managers" who only talk to each other in meetings and don't actually do anything other than make process driven recommendations, with no comprehension of the real working environment that the decisions relate to.

And I mean get rid not a matey move to another department.


You have to be cruel to be kind. Support the FTP. Deputy Hayward forced his way into being president for the reasons of good book keeping within all states departments.For the well being of this island.

Delay new buildings and make use of the ones that already exist[upgrade]Use Elizabeth collage as an example.Good maintenance program like housing did to preserve value.

Living on credit is not the way foreward.Each department must save before it purchases its new toys.If they want them now then they must find other ways of getting them[save].

The UK Goverment has streamline their staff in all departments and i am sure its from wasted or unwanted resourses.


I was told that t and r has taken on lots of high paid staff and consultants to run the FTP, why couldn't all the existing managers do this?

Dave Haslam

The problem isnt the deputies. The problem is the senior civvies who run the island anonymously whilst hiding behind their elected representatives.

Who'd be a deputy in Guernsey?

The deputies merely see the figures, they realise that the bloated inefficient civil service is incapable of such transformation over such a short period.

Loathe to use the whole Public/ Private sector argument, buts lets face it, if the SOG was a company it would have gone bust by now, its NED's (the deputies) can see this, but are effectively powerless to stop it.


That's it in a nutshell Dave