Cour du Parc tower cladding ‘was tested with a blowtorch’

THE materials used in cladding fitted to Cour du Parc flats a few years ago was tested to make sure it was not flammable, the chief executive of the Guernsey Housing Association has said.

cour
The Cour du Parc flats were renovated a few years ago. Inset: Guernsey Housing Association chief executive Steve Williams. (Picture by Peter Frankland, 18565537)

Following Monday’s devastating fire at Grenfell Tower in London, Mr Williams responded to a Facebook user’s concern at reports that the cladding fitted to the London block had helped the fire to spread so rapidly.

‘The external insulation at Cour du Parc is produced by Kingspan, a supplier to the UK and internationally, and the product is non-flammable,’ he said.

‘Before ordering it GHA staff actually tried it out by taking a blowtorch to the insulation and could not get it to light.’

He said that according to news reports the cladding used on Grenfell Tower had a polyethylene or plastic core insulation, which is a different material.

There are fire alarms in Cour du Parc, which Mr Williams said are tested weekly.

Comments for: "Cour du Parc tower cladding ‘was tested with a blowtorch’"

res ipsa loquitur

That's good news, does the building have sprinklers?

MangeTout

I'm not sure that's a good enough explanation to be honest. I wouldn't be particularly comforted by that statement if I lived there. Surely whatever product was used it would have a certification to prove beyond any doubt that it is fire retardant and passes all fire, health and safety standards and regulations?! I would rather see that in black and white rather than being told that someone held a blowtorch to it and it didn't catch fire!

gypoppy

I agree Mange Tout, on reports on tv it said the insulation in question had all the correct fire ratings, but it still caught fire. What the report said was that it probably would not have caught fire until temperatures reached about 1000C but then it did with devastating consequences. If this is correct then I would have to agree that you probably could not have set fire to it with an average blow lamp as they are just not hot enough, so who knows really happen under similar circumstances?

Pavotine

If they used one of their standard plumber's torches with MAPP gas (most likely but I don't know for sure) these things are going well over the 2000 degrees centigrade mark, as high as 2700 in fact. Even if they used a propane torch that is still going to be well over 1000 degrees C.

John West

Exactly. To be fair, the renovations on the flats have been well done and personally would not have any issues living there.

gypoppy

i wonder why my blow lamp cannot make steel glow red then

Pavotine

My Rothenberger Superfire 2 (the most popular torch amongst plumbers) with MAPP gas is designed to reach 1950 degrees centigrade and 1750C with propane.

Different torches, gasses and nozzles for different applications will show varied performance. Anyway, we don't know what kind of torch they did actually use to test the material. If I couldn't set fire to something with my blowtorch then it goes in the "doesn't burn" category for me. Not very scientific I know.

Here's the one https://www.tradecounterdirect.com/product/rothenberger-superfire2-blowtorch_type.html

donald

Anything to make saving a penny or two,and the rich get fatter and fatter!What pathetic excuses

Beanjar

Earth to donald! Who is making what excuses?!?

What's the betting this lethal cladding was EU approved, has kite marks stamped all over it and was signed off by all and sundry? I'll be glad if Brexit sees the back of EU inspired, bureaucratic, superficial, nonsense.

Le Goubert

Bean jar calm down please.

You've been mistaking the Daily Mail as newspaper again haven't you?

Silly billy!

Even Phillip Hammond, the Tory Chancellor, believes the same fairytales as you. What esteemed company you keep!

Bean jar calm down please.

You've been mistaking the Daily Mail as newspaper again haven't you?

Silly billy!

Even Phillip Hammond the Tory Chancellor believes the same fairytales.

http://www.itv.com/news/2017-06-18/cladding-used-on-grenfell-tower-is-banned-in-the-uk-says-hammond/

Prospero

Beanjar

Conversely, what is the betting that this lethal cladding has nothing at all to do with the EU ?

I will be glad to see the back of Brexit - I see your boy Davis came a cropper when talking to the grown-ups yesterday.

I can see Hammond taking over in a forced leadership election and putting up a new referendum whereby the Remainers turn the whole issue around, the UK remains in the EU and - hey presto ! the UK economy is freed from needless worry and starts to recover with immediate effect.

Hammond will then call another election and finally puts JC to bed.

And we can all have a jolly good sing song when the Last Night Of The Proms is on.

The Daily Mail explodes with xenophobia ...and we all live happily ever after.

There chap...told you everything will be ok. So, as others advise ....just chill...think calming thoughts...listen to some sooooooothing music.

You then only have your hero Trump to worry about.

Common sense

I hope that democracy is not dead but it looks like it has taken a beating.

56% of the population voted against May's hard Brexit (the very point on which she called the election) but Davis stated yesterday the plan remain unchanged.

It shows the arrogance of the May leadership that there is the possibility of another election soon and still chooses not to listen to the people.

Beanjar

Ha Ha, after the 'fake news' comes the fake statistics, Common sense my backside. I must have missed your second referendum, when was that exactly?

Common sense

Beanjar did you not notice the election a few weeks ago where May asked for a vote to give her a mandate for her hard Brexit where she lost the majority. The government received 44% of the electorates votes meaning 56% voted against her view by supporting other parties. Please point out which fact I have given is either incorrect of fake, I made no mention of a referendum.

Calling something fake news because you don't agree with it does not make it fake news.

Island Wide Voting

Aaaah thanks for clearing that up Common Sense

You were talking about the General Election ... the one with all manner of issues flying about to attract votes

Labour's allegedly costed sack of Christmas presents,the LibDems fight for school lunches,SDP's relentless push for a second independence vote,The Welsh .. not sure what the Welsh were after .. re-opening coal mines perhaps? the Green (singular) with her usual pie in the sky day dreams

Yes President elect May ballsed it all up by making it all about herself but to claim that 56% of the country voted purely against a hard Brexit (whatever that really means) is stretching the facts almost to local Assembly 'engineering' proportions

Beanjar

Correct, there was no second referendum so the only result which matters is the one from last year. Speculating why people voted and why they didn't is pointless. In my opinion many traditional Tory voters didn't turn out because they feel May lacks charisma and the strength of character to achieve a clean break with the EU. 'Soft Brexit' basically means 'no Brexit' in the minds of many people. Which party actually represented their views in the last General Election? None of the majors, only UKIP.

Common sense

IWV

Of course elections are not about one issue but they have a weighting and Brexit had a major impact on the votes cast. The BBC did an analysis of the seats that turned from blue to red since the last election and the common factor that was clearly displayed was where Labour turned over a large Tory majority were seats where the majority of the electorate voted remain.

My point is that a govenment who called the election and ran it on a specific campaign of support their idea of Brexit cannot ignore the public when they voted against them and reduced their number of seats for a majority to a minority. To state I am stretching the facts to local Assembly engineering proportions is incorrect just look at Labour who a mooting staying in the customs union and members of the Tory party asking for a softer Brexit and even Davis stating thay have to start listening clearly shows the effect Brexit had on the vote.

Prospero

Beanjar

So...let me be sure that I understand you.

You are saying that the electorate demonstrated their support for UKIP by actually not voting for them ?

That is a pretty revolutionary tactic - not sure it will catch on.

Additionally - traditional Tory voters flagged up their dis-satifaction with Mrs May by also staying home ? - Well...that went well didn't it !

You also go on to say that speculating about why people voted is pointless - but in your next sentance you go on to offer your opinion....which, my Petit Chou seems an awfully like...em...speculating.

Now...I know its been hot and I know the political scene is currently confusing so...maybe you should sit in the shade awhile.

I mean...you now appear to be offering your backside as some form of political barometer - very cheeky !

I look foward to seeing more of this on Newsnight !

Now - as I listen to the PM programme - from that bastion of honest reporting, the BBC - it would appear that the Cabinet cannot agree amongst themselves as to what exactly Brexit now means in the light of Jeremy Corbin's recent election victory.

I have to say that due to the current political confusion Brexit appears to mean all things to all men...and indeed animals...I read your post out to our dog and he was unable to make head nor Tail of your ramblings. But there again he blows hot and cold.

A bit like your backsid........

Beanjar

John Cowley, managing director of CEP, which is owned by Omnis, said: "Reynobond PE is not banned in the UK."

"Current building regulations allow its use in both low-rise and high-rise structures," Mr Cowley added.

Beanjar

New York Times, 19 June 2017 : U.K. Officials Said Material on Tower Was Banned. It Wasn’t. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/19/world/europe/uk-grenfell-tower-london-fire.html

Le Goubert

Good to see blustering idiot David Davis caving in at the first round of Brexit talks.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/19/day-one-brexit-talks-david-davis-learning-fast/

May is a dead duck walking (although I believe the thrashing she has received after the fire is totally misguided) and her hand will be weakened in any talks.

A cross-party coalition/consensus is desperately needed so the British people can be effectively represented.

Common sense

A cross party consensus is needed, the reality is that the negotiations will go on for longer than the current parliament sits and if for expample labour win the next election in 4/5 years and implement their version of Brexit will that put the process back at square one.

Prospero

Common Sense

The reality is that in view of the recent election result, a second referendum should be held.

It is my firm belief that a huge Remain vote margin would be the result.

This should then be followed by a Tory leadership run-off then a general election.

Should this happen - I believe Phillip Hammond would become Tory leader, business would rally around him and the economy would then begin to lift.

Hammond would then beat Corbyn in an election completely unclouded by Brexit and Hammond would have a 5 year term to complete an economic recovery.

We would feel the benefits here.

By inclination I am left of centre but remain unconvinced by J Corbyn's ability to strengthen the economy in the long term.

To return him (which I think is actually going to happen - whether Beanjar likes it or not) and his administration would not be unlike Atlee's in the period 1945-50.

What I can actually see happening is this:

Brexit talks will be, from the UK point of view, a disaster - they have not started well - May, who seems about to be snubbed by the DUP (who still have links to the UDA) will falter.

Johnson / Gove will challenge and Johnson will win.

Brexit will continue to go wrong and a further election will return Corbyn.

And - to make thinks even worse - our muppets will vote for the runway extension.

Common sense

My politics is just centre-right (Conservative with a small C) and I was eligible to vote in the UK election, I chose not to because I could not vote labour due to Corbyn's spending plans or conservative for their Brexit stance (that was before their disastrous manifesto).

The DUP have played the negotiations brilliantly as they know the longer it take the weaker the government appears and every day they will just increase their demands.

I can see an leadership battle in the summer with Boris the winner, at least he is still open to the idea of remaining in the single market.

Hammond is a safe pair of hands and would probobly make a good PM but if a second election happens within a year I cannot see him being able to appeal to the people the way Corbyn has. Boris is perhaps the only conservative who could successfully run and obtain a majority but he would have to change the parties Brexit strategy.

Island Wide Voting

Boris!!!! NOOOOOooooooo Biffo the clown would be a better choice

Meanwhile back at Cour du Parc. If I was a resident in that fine space saving building I would be looking for the Chief Fire Officer,or better yet Mary Lowe,to make a clear statement to the media or the Assembly to the effect that the newly cladded edifice is 100% fireproof

markB

IWV - that my son is a very good point!

markB

Some how, after tonight's news , mr Williams may be eating his words.

guern abroad

Whether Mr Williams eats his words or not but I expect to see this building will be assessed against the fire findings which are now known, as a blow torch comment is not good enough.

Island Wide Voting

Agreed

While Mr Williams' words give a degree of comfort they hold nowhere near the gravitas of a ten line official statement at next week's Assembly by Mary Lowe on behalf of her Fire Brigade Chief

guern abroad

That will probably be to soon and not give them a chance to digest the reports and then check the findings against this building. The cladding was only one element of the fire. Though a thorough review of the building to check against each pertinent point in the findings should be done.

Island Wide Voting

RG Falla carried out the refurbishment of Cour du Parc using Trespa cladding

see … rgfalla.gg/homes/project/cour-du-parc

Trespa® is a high pressure compact panel (HPL), based on thermosetting resins, homogeneously reinforced with wood based fibres and manufactured under high pressure and at high temperatures.

Don't like the sound of 'wood based fibres'

An AI Forever

Id guess the insulation is a more important factor then the actual cladding